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Poster: ghostofpig Date: Mar 1, 2007 5:46am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: If you thought that last post was bad . . . .

Cheap subject line.

Curious:

Most of you have pretty strong opinions about certain years, shows, songs, moments, etc. You seem to base your picks on genuine enjoyment of the tapes, thus avoiding the pitfall (that I sometimes fall into) of bumping a show up because you were there (being there is half the fun, but seldom does much for objectivity).

So--what do you base your choices on? Criteria? What do you look for?

Some of us have the opportunity to hear more tapes than others, and some of us have no such luxury. Sometimes it seems as if dates are posted scattershot as if they were a quick afterthought, and sometimes there seems to be discussion and consensus. Some choices seem merely subjective (nothing wrong with that) and others quite objective.

Obviously, many of us have time periods which they prefer (not me, of course; not Cliff; not Tell!) for various reasons.

So I be curious.

I am one who falls clearly into the narrowmindedness of time. For me, the great ones were shows from the time when I was young and went to see the band. I am also partial to concerts I went to, though it is nice when others agree (especially viz Dick's Picks--I was at perhaps a half dozen of those earlier ones). While I am trapped in time because I stopped listening much after 1972, I do appreciate many other suggestions. Still, I think back fondly on a time when the band and the audience were physically closer, they were young lions full of massive, nuclear power, and the scene was being born. I like the sound of 1968--1970 the best--the
phat sound. I like the more psychedlic sound of the early Dark Stars and the rawness of the early St. Stephens, the Elevens, the Lovelights, the Cautions, the Other Ones, etc.
There is a primal energy to me that seems to be lacking in the revamped group of the mid seventies onward (that is a personal, subjective opinion, and not meant as a slam. I actually like much of 1976-8; I love Blues for Allah.).

Some of this, of course, has to do with the ingestion of certain mind altering substances. Some of it has to do with the era in which it took place. But, finally, much of it has to do with the fact that this was the version of the band that I heard.

Okay--I've ramble on like the acid casualty I am--other thoughts?

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Poster: William Tell Date: Mar 1, 2007 6:30am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: If you thought that last post was bad . . . .

For me it is the energy level, lyrics, and vocal ability...though I love the old time period (you said it, 68-70), I saw them primarily from 74 through 82. At the time, and for years afterward, I preferred that time (mid 70s), and amazingly, hardly EVER listened to my early era tapes...I just had them to be 'complete.'

I had a great recording of 10-12-68 but rarely put it on. Then, the last five years, since 2002, with the arrival and availability of many more early era shows, I began giving them a serious listen...the energy of many of those just blew me away.

I came to realize Jerry never played with more energy and excitment as he did then (the 'pre fatman' Jerry), and the lyrics and vocals (young Jerry!) just made me drop all my post 74 stuff (and I have 100s of tapes of that time period).

I really am a johnny come lately to the early era though most here at the forum assume I just like the early stuff cause I'm an old fart (true). I can now appreciate that Jerry and the boys may have improved in various ways, but for the DEAD and many bands, I find that they typically peak in the first 3-7 yrs, if they last that long, and like great scientists, great philosophers, great thinkers, etc., it's all downhill from their early contributions of greatness...

Just my very biased 10 cents worth (inflation is much worse than it seems, Tiger...JOTS...whomever--sorry!).

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Poster: SDH2O Date: Mar 1, 2007 6:39am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: If you thought that last post was bad . . . .

For me it comes down to one question:

"Does Jerry sound like he's having fun tonight?"

I've listened to shows with what appear to be really nice set lists, but Jerry just never seems to get into the groove, while I've heard shows with very average set lists that Jerry just rips up every song. Again, I realize this form of "judgement" is purely subjective and others may not hear Jerry the same way. For example, the first set of Seattle 8/27/82 doesn't appear to be anything spectacular looking at the song list, but for me, Jerry sounds like he's is really into the "groove" ripping up all the solos as well as having a very strong vocal performance. Songs I personally don't care for too much, LLR and LRR, blow up here and leave me in wonder. Others have heard this set and said "Sure, some of it's good, but I just don't see it like you do."

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Poster: William Tell Date: Mar 1, 2007 6:54am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: If you thought that last post was bad . . . .

How true, SDH...the subjectivity...I have hid my deep disappointment many times this past month when someone actually leaves the room (well, at least while I am not looking) after I have put on the OOne from 12-29-68, and I am riveted (melting) to my chair and they are polite but distracted...

Even though they 'get it' they don't get it my way. I will continue to work on them, in spite of themselves...

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Poster: SDH2O Date: Mar 1, 2007 7:01am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: If you thought that last post was bad . . . .

What melts one person might leave anohter cold. I wouldn't worry so much about trying to get them to see your side; if it hits them, it hits them and sometimes no amount of trying will change them. Hey, if a certain show or song just lays you out, ain't that all you really need? If someone else is hit the same way, great; if not, no problem here, I'll just turn it up to 11 and melt by myself. As long as I'm melting.

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Poster: William Tell Date: Mar 1, 2007 7:09am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: If you thought that last post was bad . . . .

Of course. But the desire to share, and the desire to convert (misguided enthusiasm), are strong in this one...

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Poster: not_a_typical_daydream Date: Mar 1, 2007 6:27am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: If you thought that last post was bad . . . .

Everything is based on the set list. You know if the set looks like this,
Morning Dew ; Dark Star > St. Stephen > The Eleven > Death Don't Have No Mercy Cryptical Envelopment > Drums [0:13] > The Other One > Alligator > Drums > Caution (Do Not Stop On Tracks)
it's probably going to melt your face right off.
And if you get lucky and they throw in a little Mountains of the Moon and a Lovelight. That just makes it all the better.

Or if you get this,
Help On The Way > Slipknot! > Franklin's Tower ; Estimated Prophet > Saint Stephen > Not Fade Away > Drums> Saint Stephen > Terrapin Station > Sugar Magnolia Scarlet Begonias > Fire On The Mountain ; > Morning Dew
You better put on you boogie shoes.
Peace and hang loose.

This post was modified by not_a_typical_daydream on 2007-03-01 14:27:01

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Poster: deadn73 Date: Mar 1, 2007 6:30am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: If you thought that last post was bad . . . .

i pretty much listen to everything between 66-91ish. Im not gonna argue with ur assertion about the x factor - I agree with you there for the most part (except for i think 72-74 is just as potent as 68-70)
...But i listen to alot of 80's stuff simply because i like a change in sound, the effects on bobs guitar and different tones they experimented with. And theres a number of first set songs that i love, desolation row, memphis blues, brother esau..notice the pattern. Also now, especially when it comes to mid 80's, I like the thrill of the hunt, because with alot of the older stuff I know that its going to kick ass, with the 80's you gotta search. I dont even bother lookin for whole shows, i search for random moments of greatness in a Hes gone, let it grow etc.

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Poster: BlueMtnMan Date: Mar 1, 2007 1:21pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: If you thought that last post was bad . . . .

Most of the shows I attended and albums I bought date from about 69-75. When I initially started downloading, I naturally gravitated towards that era. It was easy to go back in time as well as forward a few years once I actually decided to listen to a few soundboards. Still I find it more difficult to choose shows from 79 onward. But thanks to the good Doctor and many others who have frequented this forum in the past 2 1/2 years my appreciation for the full 30 years continues to expand.

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Poster: BryanE Date: Mar 1, 2007 7:01am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: If you thought that last post was bad . . . .

This is an interesting question, ghost. And Hollow suggests a really pertinent criterion. As a number of people have said here from time to time, the sum of the band was greater than its individual components, but there's no denying that if Jerry was in his zone, then the music could soar to infinite and unpredictable heights. So, if that's evident from an initial listen, my curiosity about the rest of the show will prompt me to sit near the speakers until I get called to supper, one of the pipes in the bathroom breaks, or something else takes priority.

For the most part, I'm just looking for certain songs that I'm in the mood to hear. Sometimes I'll post an inquiry here for recommendations of hot performances. That seems to work well. Occasionally I get itchy for some of that interstellar overdrive from the early years, if you'll allow me to employ a Pink Floyd-ism, and scan through the archive for setlists that look like they will give me the scratch I need. But I do love the stuff from the years when I was able to go to the shows, with the early to mid-80's holding particular appeal.

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Poster: William Tell Date: Mar 1, 2007 10:15am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: If you thought that last post was bad . . . .

May have already told you, but Piper is one of the top ten albums of all time, in my view...impact, influence, sound, etc.

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Poster: BryanE Date: Mar 1, 2007 1:18pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: If you thought that last post was bad . . . .

You very well may have. I think it's one of those jewels that has, unfortunately, tumbled into the corner where it collects dust and gets ignored until people take some time to put the effort into finding the treasures that they've misplaced over time.

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Poster: lobster12 Date: Mar 1, 2007 8:28am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: If you thought that last post was bad . . . .

until i got to this site it was based on setlist. then I experimented with some gigs I normally wouldn't and found a lot of great stuff. My reviews and views are based on performance solely. If it's good it's good. My concert going experience does not factor in because it doesn't translate to the recording so nobody else can benefit from that.

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Poster: JamminJerome Date: Mar 1, 2007 6:31am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: If you thought that last post was bad . . . .

When I rate a show I am listening to, a lot of it comes down to the cohesiveness of the band. I am a musician with very good pitch so it really bothers me when they are out of tune - especially while singing. I also listen for energy and Jerry's solos. After that, some of it has to do with the setlist. I've listened to enough Dead that I really appreciate it when they try something new. There's a lot more, but I don't really have the time to go into every detail.

When I'm picking out a new show, I pick a year by random. Then I check to see if there's a show for todays date for that year. If not, I just pick a show that has been reviewed a lot for that year. Usually if a show has been reviewed over 10 times it is worth listening to either because its good, historical, or really awful (which is interesting in its own way).

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Poster: Sugaree83 Date: Mar 1, 2007 11:04am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: If you thought that last post was bad . . . .

It's about Jerry Garcia for me.

It's about a brilliant mind, the willingness to take risk, and the ability to perform. Drugs had something to do with it, especially in regards to the risk taking. Bottom line though, it came down to Jerry firing on all cylinders. I offer the Franklin's Tower from:

http://www.archive.org/details/gd79-11-09.sbd.stern.318.sbeok.shnf

as a reference.

I do find that many of my favorite performances took place within a few years of 1980 (on either side).





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Poster: Sugaree83 Date: Mar 1, 2007 1:17pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: If you thought that last post was bad . . . .

I further offer the Terrapin Station from:

http://www.archive.org/details/gd80-06-21.sbd.samaritano.27448.sbeok.flacf

While my first reference (Franklins Tower) revolved around risk taking and a brilliant, powerful guitar performance, this one has more to do with brilliant song writing and a simply beautiful vocal performance.



This post was modified by Sugaree83 on 2007-03-01 21:17:51